Interviews

PIB: FG Interventions In Niger Delta Not Enough – Rt. Hon. Dum Dekor

The hopes and aspirations of the people of the Niger Delta region appear to be hinged on what is derivable from their God-given resource, oil and gas.  But despite several government interventions to resolve the issues underlining derivations, their hopes and aspirations have met the brick wall.

The Petroleum Industries Bill (PIB) has remained a mirage as the bill is yet to be passed into law despite being on the table at the National Assembly for over two decades.  But there seems to be light at the end of the tunnel with the intending passage of the PIB.

Chairman of the House of Representatives Committee on Host Communities, Rt. Hon. Dumnamene Robinson Dekor, was at the studios of Arise Television on Monday, March 29, 2021 and throws light on the Bill, stressing that federal government’s intentions in the oil-rich Niger Delta is not enough.

Excerpts:

Arise: There’s a lot of expectation and anxiety about the Petroleum Industry Bill (PIB).  For about two decades, Nigeria has been trying to reform the oil and gas sector, and now this present National Assembly is promising that within the first quarter, that PIB will be passed.  The Minister of State for Petroleum Resources, Chief Timipre Silver has also said that Presidential Assent will be guaranteed without any further delay.  How optimistic are you and to what extent is the bill as presented now?  What extent does it take care of the interest of host communities who are still insisting that not enough has been done?

Dekor:  We have about 800 oil field communities and over 900 active wells in the Niger Delta which is about 70,000 square kilometers.  People living there have been living permanently on self-denial.  They are living in the Niger Delta but have nothing to show for it despite these years of exploration of oil.

As you can see, with the introduction of the PIB, we hope that it will address some of these issues.  It’s not too good when you get to visit some of these communities and see what their lives look like.  Their means of livelihood has been taken away from them and it is not any fault of theirs.

When we (the House) visited a couple of states – Bayelsa, Delta and Rivers, we had an aggregate opinion from the people.  When we did the Public Hearing, not everybody could come to Abuja, and so we had to move down to the hinterland, to meet with the people.  We visited communities, groups and took their stories and their presentations.  Right there, before them, and the process of putting them together is what is going on now.

The component of the host communities is about 2.5% as proposed but what we have seen in the field is an average of 10%.  That is what the people are demanding.  When the bill is finally ready for passage, it will address some of those areas.  It will take those sentiments into consideration and I believe that if passed and signed into law, then the host communities will be better off than they are.

Arise: Thank you for raising that demand for 10% instead of 2.5%.  Sounds like you are doing great work there.  What is your response to the fact that the Speaker, Femi Gbajabiamila, that the House of Reps would not meet that April deadline because of the Easter Holiday and then Ramadan?  Now we are looking at May which is no longer the first quarter of the year.  What is your response to that? Also, are you worried about the fact that the bill does not define ‘Host Communities’ as a term?  What is your definition of Host Communities and is that something that should be included in the bill?

Dekor:  Let me first of all thank the Speaker of the House and the leadership for finding it necessary to create this Committee on Host Community because it is a direct response to the long yearnings of the people who have been raped because there is nothing to show for it.

This Committee is there to see how we can address some of this issues, using a lot of legislative measures.  For the Speaker, I think he has made it clear that the issues of the passage of PIB is sacrosanct.  If there are shifts in date, I don’t think the shifts are for too long because you will agree that we have an Easter break and members must go home to their constituencies.  So that short period is going to affect the process of the bill and so if it is coming from April to May, I don’t see much of a problem.  After all, for the last 20 years, the bill has been in and out of parliament.  So, I will urge Nigerians to bear with the National Assembly.  I don’t see much difference between April and May.

To the issue of definition of Host Communities, if you look at what has been described or defined as the Host Community, I think we are also trying to come up with better definition of Host Community because if I have an oil well in my community as an example, it doesn’t make me the only community that have issues with environmental degradation. 

The impact in a gas flare is enormous and it travels several kilometers.  If there is contamination in underground water, it’s not located in one place and so the definition is taking a wider scope now.  You have the host communities and the impacted communities.  All of them come up to the issue of host communities.  It’s not just where you find an oil well or gas.  I think it’s a broader definition which is what most of us in host communities are also advancing.

Arise:  We’ve got 13% derivation, we’ve got NDDC, we’ve got Niger Delta Ministry, we’ve development taxes that some of the oil majors are asked to pay, and the list goes on and on.  Owing to the fact that there is oil in other parts of the world and some of these oil majors can get a better deal in other parts of the world.  Shell is rigging oil very cheap in the international market today.  You can get better services elsewhere, cost of production here is even higher and other ancillary costs one has to pay.  There is massive insecurity in the region and they are not sure their workers will have to be kidnapped and they pay heavy ransom.  There is a lot going on.  Is this not too much?

Dekor:  I think it’s not exactly too much.  We have to first of all find out how effective is the ones that are available.  If you ask me, when we talk about the Niger Delta Affairs Ministry, first of all take a look at the history.  It’s been there for quite a time, and nothing has happened about it.  It’s just a mere tool of politics and funds are not released.  It appears that the issues that have to do with the host communities are taken with levity in all fairness.  And so, to that extent, we are happy with a committee like this.

We are going to deploy all available measures to ensure that this whole gamut of agencies and interventions will be put in such a way that they will have a direct impact on the communities.  I give you an example, when you talk about the 13% derivation, they won’t even get to the States 13%. When you talk about 13% derivation, it means that the 13% will be deducted at source.  But in this case, taxes and all kinds of deductions are made.  And for these deductions, are they legitimate deductions?  Who benefits from those deductions? There are whole lots of issues around it and we are taking a cursory look at all these agencies and how best as a Committee of the House we can deploy all available legislative measures and techniques to see how we can make them more effective.

When we talk about the issue of Host Community Fund, I think that if it is captured in the way it should be, and what the communities are anticipating, they should be allowed to take full control in terms of the management of these funds.  What we see is that some of these agencies sit in the comfort of their offices and determine what projects and programmes should be for the people.  The Needs Assessment in most cases are not done in the way and manner that the communities will be carried along.

You find a community that, maybe has water and somebody sits somewhere and says they want to provide water for that community.  They have not attended to their need.  Maybe their next need in terms of priority is electricity and they don’t have it.  So, all these issues, agencies and interventions that have been put together are the reasons why the Committee has been put in place.  We will address them.

We are looking at partnerships that we can put together to enable us get to them.  If you go to Ipeju Lekki for example where you have issues of shore protection, the entire coast line is being washed away by dredging activities.  These are also areas people like to throw light on.  You discover that residents of that corridor can no longer do their natural things to survive. Their means of livelihood has been removed, so what next?  Mind you, the Dangote Refinery is coming on there, which is also an oil asset.

If you go to Niger Delta, we visited a community called Nwigbor in Gokana, you will weep. Even my colleagues who come from other parts of the country were able to see what happened there. You discover that most of these interventions, not one has gone in those places.  And that is the reason why we have been mandated to go there.  We have mandates given to us.  If we come out and partner well, the host communities will be better off.  But the issues of these interventions, we must strictly make sure that they get to the people because as it is now, they are not getting to the people.

If you look at NDDC for example, you will hear lots of projects scattered all over the Niger Delta, but when you go there, some of the roads are started in the morning and completed in the evening.  We hope that this new NDDC as set up now, will do better.  And we also hope that a lot of these agencies will sit up because we will be engaging them in a very critical manner.

Arise: There’s a lot of expectation and anxiety about the Petroleum Industry Bill (PIB).  For about two decades, Nigeria has been trying to reform the oil and gas sector, and now this present National Assembly is promising that within the first quarter, that PIB will be passed.  The Minister of State for Petroleum Resources, Chief Timipre Silver has also said that Presidential Assent will be guaranteed without any further delay.  How optimistic are you and to what extent is the bill as presented now?  What extent does it take care of the interest of host communities who are still insisting that not enough has been done?

Dekor:  We have about 800 oil field communities and over 900 active wells in the Niger Delta which is about 70,000 square kilometers.  People living there have been living permanently on self-denial.  They are living in the Niger Delta but have nothing to show for it despite these years of exploration of oil.

As you can see, with the introduction of the PIB, we hope that it will address some of these issues.  It’s not too good when you get to visit some of these communities and see what their lives look like.  Their means of livelihood has been taken away from them and it is not any fault of theirs.

When we (the House) visited a couple of states – Bayelsa, Delta and Rivers, we had an aggregate opinion from the people.  When we did the Public Hearing, not everybody could come to Abuja, and so we had to move down to the hinterland, to meet with the people.  We visited communities, groups and took their stories and their presentations.  Right there, before them, and the process of putting them together is what is going on now.

The component of the host communities is about 2.5% as proposed but what we have seen in the field is an average of 10%.  That is what the people are demanding.  When the bill is finally ready for passage, it will address some of those areas.  It will take those sentiments into consideration and I believe that if passed and signed into law, then the host communities will be better off than they are.

Arise: Thank you for raising that demand for 10% instead of 2.5%.  Sounds like you are doing great work there.  What is your response to the fact that the Speaker, Femi Gbajabiamila, that the House of Reps would not meet that April deadline because of the Easter Holiday and then Ramadan?  Now we are looking at May which is no longer the first quarter of the year.  What is your response to that? Also, are you worried about the fact that the bill does not define ‘Host Communities’ as a term?  What is your definition of Host Communities and is that something that should be included in the bill?

Dekor:  Let me first of all thank the Speaker of the House and the leadership for finding it necessary to create this Committee on Host Community because it is a direct response to the long yearnings of the people who have been raped because there is nothing to show for it.

This Committee is there to see how we can address some of this issues, using a lot of legislative measures.  For the Speaker, I think he has made it clear that the issues of the passage of PIB is sacrosanct.  If there are shifts in date, I don’t think the shifts are for too long because you will agree that we have an Easter break and members must go home to their constituencies.  So that short period is going to affect the process of the bill and so if it is coming from April to May, I don’t see much of a problem.  After all, for the last 20 years, the bill has been in and out of parliament.  So, I will urge Nigerians to bear with the National Assembly.  I don’t see much difference between April and May.

To the issue of definition of Host Communities, if you look at what has been described or defined as the Host Community, I think we are also trying to come up with better definition of Host Community because if I have an oil well in my community as an example, it doesn’t make me the only community that have issues with environmental degradation. 

The impact in a gas flare is enormous and it travels several kilometers.  If there is contamination in underground water, it’s not located in one place and so the definition is taking a wider scope now.  You have the host communities and the impacted communities.  All of them come up to the issue of host communities.  It’s not just where you find an oil well or gas.  I think it’s a broader definition which is what most of us in host communities are also advancing.

Arise:  We’ve got 13% derivation, we’ve got NDDC, we’ve got Niger Delta Ministry, we’ve development taxes that some of the oil majors are asked to pay, and the list goes on and on.  Owing to the fact that there is oil in other parts of the world and some of these oil majors can get a better deal in other parts of the world.  Shell is rigging oil very cheap in the international market today.  You can get better services elsewhere, cost of production here is even higher and other ancillary costs one has to pay.  There is massive insecurity in the region and they are not sure their workers will have to be kidnapped and they pay heavy ransom.  There is a lot going on.  Is this not too much?

Dekor:  I think it’s not exactly too much.  We have to first of all find out how effective is the ones that are available.  If you ask me, when we talk about the Niger Delta Affairs Ministry, first of all take a look at the history.  It’s been there for quite a time, and nothing has happened about it.  It’s just a mere tool of politics and funds are not released.  It appears that the issues that have to do with the host communities are taken with levity in all fairness.  And so, to that extent, we are happy with a committee like this.

We are going to deploy all available measures to ensure that this whole gamut of agencies and interventions will be put in such a way that they will have a direct impact on the communities.  I give you an example, when you talk about the 13% derivation, they won’t even get to the States 13%. When you talk about 13% derivation, it means that the 13% will be deducted at source.  But in this case, taxes and all kinds of deductions are made.  And for these deductions, are they legitimate deductions?  Who benefits from those deductions? There are whole lots of issues around it and we are taking a cursory look at all these agencies and how best as a Committee of the House we can deploy all available legislative measures and techniques to see how we can make them more effective.

When we talk about the issue of Host Community Fund, I think that if it is captured in the way it should be, and what the communities are anticipating, they should be allowed to take full control in terms of the management of these funds.  What we see is that some of these agencies sit in the comfort of their offices and determine what projects and programmes should be for the people.  The Needs Assessment in most cases are not done in the way and manner that the communities will be carried along.

You find a community that, maybe has water and somebody sits somewhere and says they want to provide water for that community.  They have not attended to their need.  Maybe their next need in terms of priority is electricity and they don’t have it.  So, all these issues, agencies and interventions that have been put together are the reasons why the Committee has been put in place.  We will address them.

We are looking at partnerships that we can put together to enable us get to them.  If you go to IpejuLekki for example where you have issues of shore protection, the entire coast line is being washed away by dredging activities.  These are also areas people like to throw light on.  You discover that residents of that corridor can no longer do their natural things to survive. Their means of livelihood has been removed, so what next?  Mind you, the Dangote Refinery is coming on there, which is also an oil asset.

If you go to Niger Delta, we visited a community called Nwigbor in Gokana, you will weep. Even my colleagues who come from other parts of the country were able to see what happened there. You discover that most of these interventions, not one has gone in those places.  And that is the reason why we have been mandated to go there.  We have mandates given to us.  If we come out and partner well, the host communities will be better off.  But the issues of these interventions, we must strictly make sure that they get to the people because as it is now, they are not getting to the people.

If you look at NDDC for example, you will hear lots of projects scattered all over the Niger Delta, but when you go there, some of the roads are started in the morning and completed in the evening.  We hope that this new NDDC as set up now, will do better.  And we also hope that a lot of these agencies will sit up because we will be engaging them in a very critical manner.

Arise: The PIB provides for the appointment of Host Communities Development Trust and the appointment of Trustees.  What is the guarantee that it is not going to be a fresh source of tension in the Niger Delta among the concerned communities?  Second, the operating cost for the investors is about the highest among the nations.  Is there any guarantee that when the PIB is eventually passed and some of the concerns of the host communities are addressed, that there will be peaceful environment in the Niger Delta?

Dekor:  When the bill is assented to by the President, I can tell you that the cost will drop.  What do you need soldiers for, to guard the pipelines?  The reason why you have soldiers there is that the people have been abandoned.  If we must understand that, these facilities are in peoples’ communities and most of them don’t even have a Health Centre.  Some don’t even have a school.  Those are the things that aggravate their anger but I believe that if communities are allowed to determine who runs it, then I see a situation where we will have peace in the Niger Delta.  And that is going to bring down drastically operating cost in any Niger Delta State, I can assure you of that.

I also asked a question about the Host Communities Development Trust and the appointment of Trustees.

 As it is proposed now, the company determines who the Trustees are and I don’t think that is right.  From our engagements across the Niger Delta, we would have rejected it completely.  And at the end of the exercise, if the people of those communities are allowed to determine who runs it with fair process, certainly we won’t have any of these issues any more.  Because if it is 5% or whatever percentage was finally agreed on the Bill andit is released, we will look at the issue. 

If you allow the people to take ownership of the process, then you won’t need one soldier anywhere in the Niger Delta.  If you allow them to take ownership of the process where the percentage that is finally agreed, is allowed for them to manage, they will determine what their priorities are.  In that case, the cost of production will be lowered drastically.

Arise: I am going to stay on that comparative note and look at national oil companies across the world, from Petropas to Petronas, Saudi Aranco to Algeria’s Sonotrac, everybody is looking towards the decline of oil and looking into investing of renewable energy, neurocarbon emission and climate change and all these phrases being bandied about.  Other people are actually taking action and Nigeria, on the other hand, with PIB we are hoping will be passed in May, we are just getting on the starting plus while other countries are at the finish line and moving on to start a different race entirely.  What should be incorporated into the PIB to embrace this reality?

Dekor: Like you rightly said, it is something that has been started and I believe that with climate change, I was privileged to attend programmes with the Ministry of Environment.  That are things that I did propose.  For example, if we can provide stiffer penalties for gas flaring, definitely the operating companies will toe the line. Government must take a look at gas because oil, as it were, is all over the place now and the cost is changing.  You can see what is in the market today.  So, I think that if government is able to have a policy that will take care of the issues of gas flaring as it is being canvassed now, then it will address more of these issues.

Arise: Tell us, what is it you will be doing with this PIB that would be different from other interventions in the Niger Delta region?  It is not that the Niger Delta has lacked interventions, it is the management of these interventions.  One, is the fact that through NDDC, this same oil majors that are still going to pay through PIB, are already paying something to the NDDC because we saw how the case of the NDDC went, the dramatics at the national house, the fainting spells and all of that.  Management has always been the problem.  What would be different this time around?  I can even go back to the time of OMPADEC to help this area but nothing seems to have been done.  Not all states have their own state development agencies.

Dekor:  That fact that the people are part of the process of this bill and when it is passed into law and accented to, their inputs are there, in the sense that if you look at this and most of the intervention agencies you talked about, a lot of them have no hold on who heads or operates them.  So, if you don’t have a hold on it, that is why you see the agitations. But if this bill is able to take account of the fact that those from those communities and the areas where this oil and the activities are taking place.  If the bill allows them to manage those resources that will accrue to the communities, I believe they will have a better process of engaging themselves to bring out the best.  Because when you have someone in my community who is mismanaging our funds, its always very easy to call the person to order.

But in the case where somebody is put in the office and you have no idea of how the person has come, it only serves a particular purpose.  But this one as proposed in the PIB, if amendments are put in place, then it will be a programme of the people and run by the people.  So, I believe they will do a whole lot better.

 

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